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stuntdog

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PostSubject: Sharp Objects   Fri Aug 03, 2018 10:11 pm


Anyone else been watching this li'l gem?
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sandi

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Sat Aug 04, 2018 12:22 pm

I've been watching.

What are your thoughts, dawg?
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stuntdog

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Sat Aug 04, 2018 8:53 pm

Maybe the best show of the year. Each episode has been excellent. The 3rd episode simply amazing! Amy Adams is one of the best actors of her (or any) generation and this is just a great demonstration of her abilities. The directing and cinematography are top notch. The soundtrack is killer as well. Another superb HBO production. Although kinda wish it was on Netflix. Cuz I woulda binged this in like 1-2 days! ;)
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sandi

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Mon Aug 06, 2018 1:38 pm

Well dawg, sometimes we agree and sometimes we disagree.  In this case, I'm going to do a little both. hai

I can't fault the acting in this one -- the cast is solid and Adams is amazing as always.  I just don't like her character all that much.  Maybe it's because, she would be puking her guts out, dying, if she really drank as much hard liquor as she does.  Have we seen her draw a sober breath?  I don't think so -- yet, she's driving around and most of the time appears to be sober but she just couldn't be -- not drinking like that.  So that's the first problem I have with the show.

Second -- I think it moves too slow.  Sometimes, it's as interesting as watching paint dry.  

The only character I actually like is Camille's dying boss and we only see a little of him.
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Big John

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Mon Aug 06, 2018 5:52 pm

Most recent ep, 105 I think, is excellent. Calhoun day is an event I'd like to attend.

As far as her drinking goes, I've known people who handle that much alcohol in their lives. The amount that she drinks daily can be done and the person can still be functional. The failure here is that it takes time to get to that point during which other symptoms have manifested themselves into something usually very noticeable like the shakes, loosening of the skin, loss of coordination, etc... You don't just suddenly become a wicked alcoholic. She doesn't seem to have ANY of the normal symptoms. So yeah, for that reason it makes it a hard buy in for me too.

The show is definitely slow and, as usual, I don't care enough to track the story line as close as the showrunners would like me to. So minor characters are once again getting lost to me.

The only other complaint I have is about the flashbacks. The sisters seem much closer in age when Amy Adams is flashing back. How old is she supposed to be in the here and now?

The mother, screaming on the porch shortly after the fight breaks out, was a bit out of character. I was like... no way would she make such a spectacle of herself.

The sister and her friend, taking drugs before the show they are starring in for all their friends and family, was the best! My guess is that it was LSD, but it's been a whole lotta years and drugs may look different now than they did back then. Loved the intentional close-up of her eyes. They were super dilated. This girl reminds me of me.
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sandi

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Mon Aug 06, 2018 6:36 pm

@Big John wrote:
The failure here is that it takes time to get to that point during which other symptoms have manifested themselves into something usually very noticeable like the shakes, loosening of the skin, loss of coordination, etc... You don't just suddenly become a wicked alcoholic. She doesn't seem to have ANY of the normal symptoms. So yeah, for that reason it makes it a hard buy in for me too.

...

The only other complaint I have is about the flashbacks. The sisters seem much closer in age when Amy Adams is flashing back. How old is she supposed to be in the here and now?

You're right about the other symptoms and maybe that's why I'm having a problem with the amount she's drinking -- because she is ALWAYS drinking.

the flashbacks -- There are three sisters -- Camille (the oldest), Marian (the one that died and she's the one we see in the flashbacks with a younger Camille), Amma (the youngest and a very bad little girl she is).

Camille and Amma have different fathers. I'm unclear if Marian was a half-sister as well. I think she was since Adora (their wonderful mother) treated her much better than Camille (like she treats Amma).

Adora, hoping to make Camille feel better, tells her she (Adora) never loved her (Camille). Rolling Eyes Adora says that Camille is too much like her father and I get the impression Adora thought he was a horrible person. But we know who the horrible person is here. I don't know what happened to Camille's father -- he either ran away (who could blame him) or he died.

Something Adora said about Camille "continuing" her body mutilations though -- it seemed to me she said something which led me to believe someone else initiated the mutilations and Camille continued them. I don't know if that is right at all though.
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sandi

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Mon Aug 06, 2018 6:38 pm

Also, do you think Amma might be the murderer?
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Big John

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Mon Aug 06, 2018 7:35 pm

I really don't know. As misdirection, a show like this will start painting a lot of it's subjects as the killer before finally identifingy the real killer with one broad stroke. A la Safe. My best guess right now is it is the mother.

Could be both the daughter and the mother though. Hadn't really suspected either of them til this episode. The way the mother reacted to the town not getting to hear her daughter sing was over the top for anyone, let alone a character wired so tight. I mean, I figured she would completely lose her shit at some point but over something like that? It shows more than just someone wired tight. It shows an obsession with her daughter. So if the mother perceived some sort of wrong doing against her daughter by the missing girls, she might have had a murderous meltdown.
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sandi

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Tue Aug 07, 2018 7:34 am

I agree that the mother, Adora, could be a murder suspect.  Emotionally and morally, I do believe she is more than capable.  But, let's not forget her aversion to physical exertion and her rather "delicate" constitution.  

Recall that one little boy claims one of the murder victims went off with "the lady in white" who mysteriously appeared at the edge of the woods.  His account is not being taken seriously which, I believe, is a big mistake.  I think, given what we've seen of him so far, that he is a very credible witness.

The youngest daughter, Amma, is also on my suspect list.  There's something mean and evil about her.

I do have one more suspect and right now, he's top of my list and that is ... Alan Crellin (Adora's husband and Amma's father.)  The man is wound real tight and we know Adora is denying him sexual favors and has him under her thumb.  I can see him even dressing up as "the woman in white" -- luring teenage girls away from safety and into his murdering arms.
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Big John

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Tue Aug 07, 2018 8:44 am

Very interesting and quite probable. I do enjoy your powers of deduction, Sandi. My only issue with it is that step daddy isn't a leading character. I think it has to be one of the main leads in order for the show to make an impact. He may very well be in on the cover up though. I just don't think he's the primary, even though he may have been put in a situation where he had to commit the crime... if that makes sense.

If he is the primary, imho, that's just boring. I don't know enough about his world to care. My bet is that in the second or third last episode they will tell his story and make it seem as though he had motive and opportunity. Then it won't end up being him.

Oh my radar are:
The Sheriff
The Mother
The Daughters
The G-Man
Pennywise
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sandi

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:16 am

I don't see the Sheriff or the G-Man (Kansas City cop?) as ever dressing up in a white gown and passing themselves off as a woman to lure girls into the woods.  And I firmly believe that happened.  I think that kid is a credible witness.

Pennywise lol2
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Big John

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Tue Aug 07, 2018 10:00 am

I think they intentionally made the kid look like he's credible simply by the sheer fact that none of the characters give him a second thought, which gives the audience an aha moment. I think that's part of of the misdirection that the show is using. No idea what the kid really saw though. I do believe he saw something.

How awesome would it be if it turned out to be Pennywise!!!
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Pi-O-My

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:27 pm

@stuntdog wrote:
.... Although kinda wish it was on Netflix. Cuz I woulda binged this in like 1-2 days! ;)

This show would be dangerous to your health to binge! What a spectacularly unhappy family!

Sandi, I agree that the father is a likely suspect, since (after the mother telling him, no, she did not want his company that night -- Ep. 3, IIRC) it wouldn't surprise me if he liked to dress up in white gowns. And I'd never discount an eyewitness just because he was a kid. But I think the mystery is mostly a good peg for hanging an examination of messed up family dynamics.
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sandi

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:36 pm

@Pi-O-My wrote:
@stuntdog wrote:
.... Although kinda wish it was on Netflix. Cuz I woulda binged this in like 1-2 days! ;)

This show would be dangerous to your health to binge! What a spectacularly unhappy family!

Agreed! hai

@Pi-O-My wrote:
Sandi, I agree that the father is a likely suspect, since (after the mother telling him, no, she did not want his company that night -- Ep. 3, IIRC) it wouldn't surprise me if he liked to dress up in white gowns. And I'd never discount an eyewitness just because he was a kid. But I think the mystery is mostly a good peg for hanging an examination of messed up family dynamics.

You nailed that peg!

Back to the dad -- Yes, that scene definitely seals him as a suspect in my mind. His calm facade is very thinly layered over a very angry and disturbed man. But, I hesitate being sure about him as I can't quite picture him pulling the teeth out of victims' mouth. That takes a really sadistic mind and I don't know if he's got that. We don't get to see very much of his true self.

I can see Amma pulling teeth out, though.
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Pi-O-My

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:13 pm

@sandi wrote:
....I can see Amma pulling teeth out, though.

Do we know if the victims were still alive during that gruesome detail? Ugh, I don't want to know. But yeah, Amma, though they did make the point that it was physically difficult to do. (The teeth thing seems relevant because the mother pulls out her eyelashes.)

I think the series was wise to have the father not listen to classical music since that would have clinched the cliche and pronounced him guilty. We do need more background about him, and why/how the mother is such a bigwig in the town, and what happened to Camille's father -- she doesn't seem to have any of those jagged little memories of him, which is interesting. (I've only seen through episode 3 so far, so I'm trying to avoid much reading around here. I guess I'm the opposite of you, Dawg! We tend to dawdle at the House of Pi.)
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sandi

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:03 am

Quote :
Do we know if the victims were still alive during that gruesome detail?

You know, I think that was addressed and I'm glad you're asking the question and only being on episode three. Perhaps the answer is between episode 4 and present. I do think it was addressed and just can't remember what was said.

Quote :
why/how the mother is such a bigwig in the town, and what happened to Camille's father

The mother comes from an "old" town family -- upper class and property owner. I think she's attempting to continue that antebellum Southern "charm" which plants her family firmly as the town's leading citizens -- or something like that.

You mentioned that Camille doesn't seem to have any memory of her father and I hadn't thought about that but you're right. I think that would indicate that he made an early exit from her life as her childhood memories prior to her sister's death seems to show Camille as a somewhat well-adjusted, fun-loving kid. If she had been a victim to any paternal abuse, I don't think that would be the case. So, I'm guessing the dad couldn't tolerate Adora like her current husband can or maybe Adora killed or had him killed to remove an unwanted inconvenience in her life?
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Big John

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Fri Aug 10, 2018 3:51 pm

I don't know enough about step-dad to suspect him. The clues are circumstantial if that, at least the ones we know about are. You're right about the mother not having the physicality to do some of the stuff, but... Hey... New thought... What about Elizabeth Perkins? I don't think she's on anyone's radar yet and she is a prominent secondary character.

Anyway, if the mother is in on this she certainly isn't alone, and she is my number one suspect. I do not think she has done this with hubby. Don't believe she'd be denying him, and only considering him when she fancies, if they were in on it together. I think she'd have more respect for him.

MomAmma (yes, I shipped them) are my suspects. I need to watch from the start again in order to find more evidence to support this. Best thing I have is what I said before about Mom's apparent obsession over Amma.

Also though, as it was unfolding, I found it awfully odd how Mom was so fervently against Amy Adams interviewing that guy (can't remember his name but he's the father of one of the dead girls). Not only did she object to the interview of her guest, which I can reconcile, but as I recall she also staunchly defended him as if she knows he's innocent.

Never would have thought I'd get so wrapped up in a couple of summer filler shows.

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sandi

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Mon Aug 13, 2018 3:36 pm

Is it possible to wallow any more in the same baggage?

Did the plot move forward at all in any direction?


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Pi-O-My

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Mon Aug 13, 2018 3:39 pm

WARNING for New York Times readers! SPOILER ALERT! I realize I'm the poky puppy here but for anyone else who does not yet know who done it and is behind in their Times reading --I was warned by a friend to avoid the book review supplement of July 22, in which an article by Ruth Franklin (boo hiss) names names.


So, back to Wind Gap. Now I'm thinking that it's less likely to be the mother's husband (I guess it's not accurate to call him the father) for politically correct reasoning. It becomes less a series about women's autonomy, women's agency, if the most important actions were done by a man, and this is at heart a movie about women and their relationships. MomAmma :)  feels like a Tennessee Williams kind of shipping, Big John, but it's in keeping with "steel magnolias."
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Pi-O-My

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Wed Aug 22, 2018 4:12 pm

The traditional Calhoun Day play makes me wonder why women haven’t been killed off regularly in that forsaken town! (Admittedly, the special effect of the flames was clever, but, yikes, that tale is not appropriate for children, and should not have been performed by teenagers!) That’s aside from the racial aspects that the festivities ignore.

I did like how the (spelled-out, like on the theatrical curtain) words kept changing. That seems especially smart in light of the episode’s emphasis on Camille’s work as a writer. And their variability is a reminder that our seeing what happens is perhaps not to be trusted, unreliable narrator and all that.

Unfortunately, by half-way through, the series does seem to be drifting on atmospherics. I don’t mind plot being doled out slowly but barely any information seems to be there. There was a semi-buried nugget in Camille’s flashback to her mother talking with a photographer in the ivory-floored room, which indicated Adora was more in tune with the maternal (Calhoun) side of her family than the Preaker (the pig farmers) side. That’s despite the Preaker family being the one with the money, which she has been the recipient of, and that their hog business seems to be the town’s current major employer.
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Big John

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:23 am

SPOILER!





The tooth looked so fake that it kinda wrecked the final scene for me. It distracted from the impact we're supposed to feel about Amma being revealed as the killer (potentially), which wasn't much of a reach anyway. Plus, did we learn why teeth are the souvenirs?

Not crazy about the overall direction of the show despite not being able to take my eyes from it. I think the poison scenes in the finale were meant to come off as true horror but they fell flat in that regard.
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stuntdog

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Mon Aug 27, 2018 10:01 am

Did everyone actually see the 2 closing credits scenes? If not, go back and watch 'em now! fnger
Thought the series was bloody brilliant. Loved everything about it. yay
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catnap

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:13 pm

Wow, that ending!

SPOILERS


So, mom had that syndrome that I can't spell, but Amma killed the girls?

I did see the scenes at the end, but it was hard to interpret. What did you see, Vince? Was it Amma hurting her new friend?

I loved the show overall. My kind of series, spooky, atmospheric, mysterious, flawed characters, etc.

A few things. What happened in the cabin? I guess CAmille was raped? Did Amma kill someone there?

Did I miss something about the ivory floor? Aside from it being more important to the mom than her kids?

Did anyone notice buildings and businesses changed names sometimes in the same scene? Not sure it was intentional.
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Pi-O-My

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PostSubject: Re: Sharp Objects   Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:50 pm

The series was fascinating but for me, it fell apart in its ending. So much information was crammed into the last maybe 20 minutes that it was hard to figure out the details. If Adora was jailed for murdering Marian and/or attempting to murder Camille and Amma, did the poisonous mother also take the rap for her youngest daughter in the killing of the two teens? I’m unconvinced that it would have been credible to a jury that Adora could have done that alone, without the help of the skaters or Alan. It seems clear that Camille has realized that the sister she rescued is a murderer (and that the dead teens' teeth were removed to build the dollhouse floor.) But I'd like to have gotten to see her wrestle a bit with whether or not to follow in the Wind Gap tradition of protecting the guilty -- we saw little more than Camille's realization of the killings.

Catnap, the hunting cabin was a mystery to me, too. Based on Camille’s flashback, it looked more like she was raped in the woods but outdoors. I have no idea why Amma would run away there on Calhoun Day – it certainly didn’t feel like a safe space – though I guess it’s possible that the murderous skaters would hang out there.

Adora’s bedroom floor being made of ivory was, I think, like a plantation house built by enslaved people, one more exploitation done in the past carried into the present. It’s a lovely, fragile layer, like the lies of the town. And, though teeth from the slaughtered pigs could have been used, Amma chose to replicate it with the teeth of the girls she was jealous of.

The changing store signs, I think, were similar to all the other words (like the stage curtain from “Calhoun Day” to “Shallow Play”) in that the changes were to emphasize that we were seeing things from Camille’s biased point of view. Some of the visualized words (like the “Ask!” on Camille’s work cubicle wall, and “Punish” on a license plate) seemed naturalistic but the shifting words (like “Queasy” instead of “English” above a store) sometimes felt like comments on Camille’s emotions at the time but sometimes more like Rorschach test connections (like “Petticoat” on a fireplace.)
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